Church is back in session

I think the pictures speak for themselves, my two favorite things. Curves and football, not necessarily in that order!

Death and longing

I received some rough news yesterday. My cousin passed on Monday night. It is sad, I will miss him, there are so many memories, stories I still tell my son.

Chad M. West. I will miss you buddy.

My body is a temple

Given that, it now has one more additional stained glass window

I wish religion were this tasty

If religion looked like her, I would be in church praying to the holy bootie every Sunday and twice on Friday!

Payday sucks

I have direct deposit, and od xouese just when you count on it, my emoloyer screws it up..fees to deal with

Is it him? Sunderland friends find the face of Jesus in a Chinese takeaway - All News - Sunderland Echo

Is it him? Sunderland friends find the face of Jesus in a Chinese takeaway - All News - Sunderland Echo

Wow. What do they think? God is revealing himself in chinese takeout?

OOOOOH That's proof that God exists!!

Jackson Hole Here I come

This post has nothing to do with religion or politics.

I am FINALLY going on VACATION! I need the freakin' time off! WooHoo!!

I am of course going with my in-laws so I will probably have some great stories to share when I get back.

White Water for me!!!

I can't wait

Typical Mormon Jibber Jab

Have you noticed how Mormon "defenders" always twist logic and fact to meet their twisted view of reality?

I read an article in The Salt Lake Tribune where the author goes out of her way to defend the Mormon Church from accusations that Joseph Smith was a fraud. It's almost humorous.

In one sentence she says:"I have to disagree with the article’s implicit conclusion that leaving Mormonism — or indeed any religious tradition — is the only logical choice for a rational, educated person."

But it is! If you are logical and look at things from a point of view of reality and reason, you would choose to leave.

She then says "The logic behind this loss of faith — Joseph Smith was a fraud, therefore the religion that he founded is phony, and one’s entire experience as a Mormon is bogus — is actually just the reverse of how many Mormons approach their faith. If the Book of Mormon is true, the thinking goes, then everything Joseph Smith did or said was divinely inspired. And if Joseph Smith was divinely inspired in everything, then everything about the church is just how God wants it."

As you can see from the above quote, she specifically and pointedly lets you know that Mormons live in delusion. They ignore fact and reality and instead live in a fantasy world where they can twist the truth and the facts to fit their warped sense of truth.

She then goes on to say "I am an active Mormon and I love my church. At the same time, I can empathize with the disillusionment felt by those who investigate LDS history for the first time after having been exposed only to sanitized versions of church history."

That's funny considering that the 'sanitized' version is what is TAUGHT in church to all the faithful. The ONLY way that a member of the LDS Church learns anything other than that is if they look outside the faith and see what is there.

Here's what I see; Much like a True/False test in school, if ANY part of the question is false, the entire question is false. If  I extrapolate it out, if any part of the faith is false the entire faith is false. How can a faith be true and correct if it is founded on falsehoods? Logically, it cannot be. Therefore it MUST be false and incorrect.

Since there is a myriad of evidence proving that many of the principles and foundations of the LDS church are false, the entire faith must then be false.

I am going to list just a couple of the falsehoods of the church. You tell me, how can it be true if these falsehoods exist?

1 - The Book of Abraham (the scrolls that JS "translated" from were Egyptian Funerary scrolls. nothing special at all and definitely NOT the story of Abraham)

2 - The blatant plagiarism of the Book of Mormon from the Bible. (I realize that the Bible is fiction too, it's just sad that Joseph Smith stole from such obvious fiction)

As I said earlier. It's a lie. Open your eyes and see it for what it is.

How to tell if your religion is bad? 5 signs!

According to Shayne Looper of the GateHouse News Service, there are 5 signs that your religion may be bad. I am going to take it a bit further and say 5 signs that ALL religion is bad.

1 - It makes people servants of an ideology rather than of the common good or their fellow man. These are people that value the differences in their belief structure more than they value their friends, family or fellow man. Every religion suffers from this malady.

2 - Religion makes people unhappy. Religion promises joy and happiness BUT ONLY after ALL other preconditions are met.

3 - Religion is founded on excluding others. Religion in any form is an alienating force, it pushes non-believers away and believers together, alienating anyone with differing beliefs from the group. The leaders of religions spend a large amount of their time speaking almost happily of others failures and how wrong other groups are for believing in their own way.

4 - Religion uses the Us/Them rhetoric to justify classifying non-believers as "the enemy". A prime example is "the war on religion". There isn't a war on religion, just folks trying to not be force-fed some superstitious beliefs that we ALL know are garbage.

5 - Religion is compassionless. Religion is self-centered. It is all about finding self-fulfillment, rather than truth. Being right rather than being fair and gaining success instead of offering kindness. This leaves little to no room for compassion.

I am not sure exactly how people continue to stay in groups that encourage this behavior. As a parent I always tried to teach my son to be compassionate, caring and kind to others. This is WHY I didn't indoctrinate him with religion.

I find the superiority complex that many religious folks have offensive and abusive. My own nephew goes out of his way to tell all the 'non-member' (not LDS) cousins in the family how "It must suck to not be Mormon."  His arrogance is appalling. I have brought it up to his parents to no avail. It's just sad. On a bright note, my son did kick his butt for it once, that was good times.

Defending Mormonism?!?

I was on the Mormon.org website reading some rather bland but somewhat interesting articles and came across this defense of Mormonism not being a cult. I thought I would share it here since my responses will never see the light of day on their site. My responses will be in bold italics  inside their responses.

First here is their defense/ statement regarding being labeled a cult:

One definition listed for ‘cult’ in Webster’s Dictionary is “a religion regarded as unorthodox.” Since the roots of Mormonism are not a break off from the Catholic or Protestant churches, it is seen by some as “unorthodox.” No, it is seen as unorthodox because it was made up out of thin air by Joseph Smith. For example, the LDS definition of the Godhead differs from the Nicene Creed accepted by most Catholic or Protestant churches. The “cult” label is usually applied by Church opponents attempting to criticize or discredit the Church. Again, incorrect. The cult label is applied to the LDS Church because it behaves like a cult. (see my previous post on this for more evidence)However, sometimes it’s simply a matter of characterization that has grown up over time by the lack of understanding. Such misunderstandings often vanish when people begin to realize the commonality of what The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints really teaches and believes. That Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that He is the Savior and Redeemer of the world whom we love and worship. Along with Joseph Smith right? When people begin to see and recognize these things about Mormons, then their opinion of the Church usually changes, and old beliefs are replaced with new understanding.

What I really see when I read this is the following: LDS inc. does NOT address any of the issues behind WHY people label them as a cult. They don't deal with the facts that their BOM was plagiarized from the bible, that the Book of Abraham was a complete FRAUD. Nor, do they address any of the charges surrounding their being a cult and false doctrine to say the least.

Here are some of the comments defending Mormonism on the site:

Mormon's are viewed as a cult by some because we do not adhere to the fundamental creeds established by the other Christian churches, such as the Nicene or Athenian Creeds, and their view of the Godhead. Latter-day Saints are viewed by other Christians just like the early Christians were viewed by the Jews and Romans of the time, which was as a cult, because they strayed from what seemed to them orthodox Judaism. AND much like the early Christians and any other religion on the planet, IT IS A CULT. Much like the Pharisees and Sadducee's, who viewed orthodoxy through the lens of the rules laid out in the rabbinical law and their interpretation of the Law of Moses, the Christians of today view orthodoxy through the lens of the creeds that were established hundreds of years after the death of Christ under the opinion and counsels of men. Oh, and Mormons don't? Really? What about the "earring revelation" at General Conference a few years ago? What about all the ramblings of Brigham Young? What about the B.S that Joseph Smith spouted? All the "counsels of men" right?

I think some call Mormonism a cult mainly because they don't understand what it's about. Before I was a Mormon, I used to believe that Mormons did not believe in the Bible, in Jesus Christ and a good deal of other things. I didn't realize how incorrect I was. There have been some pretty amazing things that have happened in conjunction with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, and if you don't get the whole picture, then some of the stuff can sound pretty odd, and I think that's where I was before. Some of the stuff can sound ODD? No, it is WEIRD to the maximum degree. Let me guess, you think all the throat cutting motions and talking to the 'devil' in the temple is normal right?

An example I sometimes use is: if someone told you that he had cut a man with a knife, from that limited piece of information, you'd probably report him for stabbing someone. But if you found out that this someone was a Doctor, and that he was preforming a surgery to save a man's life, having the full story completely changes your perspective on the situation. In that analogy possibly. What doctor in his right mind would just say "I cut someone with a knife"? NONE! Doctors wouldn't say that, only someone uneducated and not a doctor would say that. It's a ridiculous position.

In regards to the church I belong to, once I did have the whole story,  You don't have the whole story. If you did, you would leave. Much like the 70% of converts do. I could see that Mormons were not cultish, but that they really are in fact Christians. Which by the way are a cult too. I've even found that I have a stronger love of the the core things I believed before I was a Mormon, like the Bible and Jesus Christ Good for you! You love your imaginary friends and fictional novels. Good for you.

To sum things up:

Mormonism like all religion is a cult. A cult designed to take your money, your time and your energy and in return give you a warm, fuzzy feeling. Not much of a trade off.

I cannot think of a single religion that doesn't display cultic behavior. If you can, please let me know.

Mormon411: My Conversion - From Mormonism to Atheism

Mormon411: My Conversion - From Mormonism to Atheism: Last week I published the testimony of the person who authors http://becominglds.blogspot.com/ . This LDS blogger has a few other Mormon re...

I read this on my Bro-inlaws blog and wanted to share it here. It's very poignant and makes some very valid points.

Fake Bill Collector Scam!

There I was on my day off, relaxing and enjoying some time with my wife. Catching up on The Hatfields & McCoys that we DVR'd, when I get a text message.

The message read: "You've had ample notice & ignored your obligation. You have 4 hrs to call 888-699-9726 to pay or it goes out for legal/civil action. A14214."

I was surprised to say the least. I don't have any obligations that I correspond with via text messaging. The last time I had an account that would text me was my car note, which by the way, I paid off and have the title for the car OVER A YEAR AGO. They would only text me to remind me of my due date each month, which I actually appreciated.

This brings up a couple of issues:

1 - They didn't put my name or any other identifying information in the text message. How do they know if it's even the RIGHT PERSON they are texting with this information?

2 - It is a violation of the FDCPA for a collection agency to reveal information of that nature via text messaging, especially when they don't have permission (I didn't sign up for it) to send the information.

3 - Threatening legal action is illegal according to the FDCPA.

4 - No listing of the original creditor or the name of their company? Illegal as well.

I Googled the phone number and what do you know? Nothing but complaints from people that got the same text messages. Some of those poor people actually called the number and made arrangements to pay this supposed debt. These poor people actually allowed a company that violated their rights access to their accounts to debit the funds this 'company' says they owe.

I read of several instances where this 'company' told people that they couldn't pay via money order but that they had to pay via CC or bank account. FRAUD. Anyone knows that collection agencies MUST accept payment for a debt in whatever form you choose to send it. This same company also refused to give these people their address or contact information, stating that: " If you don't make arrangements now, we will file suit and you will have to pay back 10x the amount." So, a "debt" of say $300 now becomes $3000? NOT LEGAL.

Several things you should look out for when dealing with anyone that says you owe them money:

1 - In writing, send them a Validation of Debt letter. You can find many examples of this just by googling it.

2 - Demand that they give you their address, registered agent and the original creditor when you speak with them.

3 - Do NOT make any arrangements to pay anything UNTIL they have validated the debt to YOUR satisfaction.

4 - Understand your rights: Read the FDCPA (Fair debt collection practices act)

5 - It is ILLEGAL for a collector to call you before 8am and after 9pm.

6 - It is ILLEGAL for a collector to threaten you in any way.

7 - It is ILLEGAL for a collector to call you and harass you.

8 - It is ILLEGAL for a collector to divulge ANY information about the debt to anyone but the debtor.

9 - When asked, the collector MUST give you their address and all contact information.

10 - Collectors MUST accept payment from you in whatever form you choose to send it. They cannot demand any specific type of payment.

If you ever have questions or feel that you are being abused by a collector, contact your local Attorney Generals office and let them know what is happening. As an added bonus, any time they violate the FDCPA, it's $1500 to YOU!

Document when they violate your rights, keep track and you can beat back the cheats!

Am I better than you?

The question is rhetorical. I honestly do not believe I am better than anyone.

I may be better at some things than someone else, does that make me better overall? No, different, not better.

My train of thought goes to this due to some of the comments I have received here; am I upset or irritated by them? No.

Do they warrant a response? Yes, I think they do.

1. - Do I think Atheists are better than Theists? No, I don't. Do I think that they are different and that there are differences? Yes I do.

2. - Do I think that religious folks are a bit sensitive when I point out obvious flaws in their logic? YES I do! It's funny how when I point out something simple and they fly off the handle accusing me of attacking them when all I did was point out something obvious to everyone BUT them.

3. - Do I find the contradiction in a 'christians' behavior entertaining and hypocritical? Yes, I do. A prime example is some of the comments I have received where someone who purports to be "christian" attacks with curse words and insults rather than simply defending their position. Everyone is welcome to defend their position of course I have only run into a couple people that are actually literate and intelligent enough to attempt a debate. Most of the "defenders of Christianity" or religion that have commented here are of the illiterate variety and resort to throwing insults rather than arguing their point. That probably has more to do with the FACT that their position is untenable and cannot be defended so they resort to playground tactics.

4. - Will I stop voicing my opinion? Nope, sorry all you illiterate morons that throw insults. I won't. I do welcome intelligent debate, sadly you are few and far between.

5. - Do I see anonymous posters as weak? Not necessarily, the only weaklings I see are the anonymous posters that attack and throw insults. Very weak in my book.

6. - Is religion a scam and cult like? Yes, I think it is. Correct me if I'm wrong, and I don't think I am; Religion has done nothing to promote the well being of the human mind. Only efforts to retard our growth and intellect.

7. - Does religion have some validity? From the standpoint of teaching good values like being kind to each other, yes it does. Does that mean that I think religion is good? No, I don't think it's good. Religion closes minds to exploration and thought. That is NEVER a good thing.

All in all, I am all about INTELLIGENT discussion and debate. Insults and whining while entertaining don't endear you to me in any way. It only VALIDATES my point that religion breeds hate, closed-mindedness, bigotry and intolerance. Not the qualities I want my child to learn.

Until religion and religious folks in general can see it and themselves for what they are, my opinion won't change.

There is nothing, I repeat, nothing redeeming about a group of people that hate and teach their children to be intolerant of others. Nothing at all.

Mormon group still using discredited 'gay cure' therapy

Mormon group still using discredited 'gay cure' therapy

The initial scientist, who came up with this disavows it as not good science, they are still using it?

Flies in the face of logic I think?

Is Hell exothermic or endothermic?

The following is supposedly an actual question given on a University of Washington chemistry mid-term. The answer by one student was so "profound" that the professor shared it with colleagues, via the Internet, which is, of course, why we now have the pleasure of enjoying it as well.




Bonus Question: Is Hell exothermic (gives off heat) or endothermic (absorbs heat)?



Most of the students wrote proofs of their beliefs using Boyle's Law (gas cools when it expands and heats when it is compressed) or some variant.



One student, however, wrote the following:



First, we need to know how the mass of Hell is changing in time. So we need to know the rate at which souls are moving into Hell and the rate at which they are leaving. I think that we can safely assume that once a soul gets to Hell, it will not leave. Therefore, no souls are leaving.



As for how many souls are entering Hell, let's look at the different Religions that exist in the world today. Most of these religions state that if you are not a member of their religion, you will go to Hell. Since there is more than one of these religions and since people do not belong to more than one religion, we can project that all souls go to Hell.



With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number of souls in Hell to increase exponentially. Now, we look at the rate of change of the volume in Hell because Boyle's Law states that in order for the temperature and pressure in Hell to stay the same, the volume of Hell has to expand proportionately as souls are added.



This gives two possibilities:



1. If Hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls enter Hell, then the temperature and pressure in Hell will increase until all Hell breaks loose.



2. If Hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in Hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until Hell freezes over.



So which is it?



If we accept the postulate given to me by Teresa during my Freshman year that, "it will be a cold day in Hell before I go out with you", and take into account the fact that I went out with her last night, then number 2 must be true, and thus I am sure that Hell is exothermic and has already frozen over.



The corollary of this theory is that since Hell has frozen over, it follows that it is not accepting any more souls and is therefore, extinct . . . leaving only Heaven, thereby proving the existence of a divine being which explains why, last night, Teresa kept shouting "Oh my God."

I thought we could all use a good laugh today.

Should you leave your church?

A recent comment got me thinking about this;

Should you leave your religion?

Honestly, I don't know if you should or shouldn't. It's not really my call to tell you to leave, it would be extremely arrogant of me to presume that I can tell you what you should or shouldn't do.

Did I leave the LDS faith? Yes I did. Why did I leave? I left simply due to the fact that I could no longer reconcile the contradictions and falsehoods perpetuated by the faith. These falsehoods and the corresponding hypocrisy was more than I could take. I couldn't see how I can call myself a believer in something that I found patently fraudulent.

Am I saying that religion doesn't have it's place? Yes, I am. It is an outdated, set of beliefs founded on the premise that there is a magical being in the sky that created the universe yet refuses to leave any PROOF whatsoever of said beings existence. The only 'proof' that anyone can offer is the ramblings of cave dwelling folks that we would have called lunatics writing in a mystical fashion about current events of their time.

Is that a valid reason to follow the words of the worlds first broadly circulated work of fiction? I didn't think so, so I walked away from religion. I didn't just stop believing in the Mormon way of looking at things, I investigated and researched every religion that I could, Hinduism, Islam, Satanism, Paganism, Mormonism, Christianity, Judaism every 'ism I could find. What did I learn? I learned that they were ALL THE SAME. Same stories, same philosophies, same everything! The only differences? The names and dates and sometimes the locations changed, the stories? They essentially for all intents and purposes were the same, leading me to the logical conclusion that they all come from the same place. That place is IMAGINATION.

Since I don't follow the Gingerbread man, I can't in all logical justification follow another fantastic individual like Jesus, Mohamed or Krishna. I just can't do it. I like fantasy stories as much as the next person. I read fiction all the time, I don't follow the philosophies of a fictional character. I don't belong to the First Church of Harry Potter or any other such drivel.

I work from fact, science and logic. Those three things have no place in religion since religion discounts them all as non-essential. Therefore; religion has no place in my life.

If you want to belong to a religion, if it fulfills you. If it gives you purpose, feel free and justified in believing it. All I ask is this; let me and others like me be who we are in peace. I propose the following, don't push your faith on me in public places, government offices or public schools and I won't come into your Churches, synagogues or ward houses and push my logic and science on you.

Fair enough? I think so.

Defending the LDS Church? Only with rhetoric..

Going through the interwebz, I read an article on the Deseret News website that I found entertaining and if the author wasn't serious I would have found it hilarious. As it is, he was serious, so in all reality it's almost sad; no it's disappointing.

In the article, the writer attempts to defend the LDS Church from such terrible slights as:

Claiming that Sunday Services are held in Temples! Yes, that is a slight because EVERYONE in the world knows that Mormons don't go to their temples on Sundays right?

Stating that Sunday services are 3 hours long and consist of sacrament (with water swapped in for wine) and then 2 more hours of preaching and meetings. (ummm. Growing up Mormon, that effectively sounds like Sundays in a Mormon meeting house). I realize the description isn't 100% accurate, it is close though. Not really a need to be condescending to the person who wrote the article though.

Speculating that Mitt Romney would attend the same church house as Harry Reid. OMG, Really? That's an issue? Oops, I forgot EVERYONE in the world would KNOW that Mormons have separate congregations called "wards" that meet at different times and are separated geographically right? Because EVERY other religion in the world is organized that way too...

The author then goes on to attack Callahan for the following: (it's easier for me to put the entire piece here for you to read)
• Callahan wrote about going to the Washington D.C. Temple Visitors Center, talking to young female missionaries who "wear calf-length skirts, flat shoes and an indefatigable air of energized piety." Then she added: "Less than two hours after my visit – despite giving staffers only my first name and filling out no paperwork – I was startled to get a voicemail on my cell phone from someone identifying himself as a prophet, saying that he'd like to 'start interceding for your life' and asking me to call an 800 number to join a prayer circle." Callahan blithely linked the two events, inferring that the phone call came as a result of her visit to the visitor's center. The Newsroom article on the LDS missionary program would have told her that missionaries are referred to as "elder" and sister," not "prophet," and that their work has nothing to do with "interceding for your life" or organizing "prayer circles." And common sense should have told her that there's no way the missionaries could have come up with her cell phone number based only on her first name.




There are other issues within Callahan's column, most of them similarly mixing a little truth with a lot of misunderstanding — most of which could have been avoided with a few clicks on the LDS Newsroom website.

Seriously?!?! If I were Maureen Callahan and got a voice mail shortly after visiting with some Mormon missionaries and got the message she got and knew little to nothing about the Mormons, I would INFER the same thing. Rather than attacking her and subtly calling her lazy and stupid, wouldn't it have been better to maybe, just maybe let her know what you would like her to know. Instead of writing a column damning her for her lack of knowledge, EDUCATE her.
 
Sadly though, this is typical Mormon behavior. Attack someone instead of educate them. After all, you are being persecuted by someone right? WRONG!
 

Apocalypse never: Newly discovered Mayan calendar disproves 2012

Apocalypse never: Newly discovered Mayan calendar disproves 2012

Fun and interesting read. I found it entertaining.

Religious people are LESS Compassionate

In a recent study at The University of California Berkley, researchers found that highly religious people were less compassionate than Atheists or Agnostics.

In three different experiments researches found that Atheists tended to be motivated more to help their fellow human being simply out of compassion. Conversely, highly religious individuals tended to help others out of one of three primary motivations: Doctrine, communal identity and reputational concerns .

It seems to me that even though Atheists are less trusted according to numerous studies and surveys, that Atheists and non-religious people tend to be more generous and compassionate simply out of the desire to help someone.

Maybe, just maybe religious people can take something from this.

Helping for the sake of helping is good. Helping so that you can keep your social standing etc. is just selfish. There is NOTHING altruistic in working to keep your social standing in your individual church etc.

Atheists we are kind and compassionate! Yes, we are it's a fact.

I dare a religious person to come here and tell me different.

Humans really are still evolving, study finds

Humans really are still evolving, study finds

This is the kind of thing that EVERYONE should read and understand!

Hmmm. I wonder, how will the "Bible Thumping" folks argue this? Will they say it's false and of the devil? Probably, they would be wrong, they will insist on it anyway....

How the "holier than thou's" have fallen!

It appears that the founders of that cancer that plagues the airways also known as TBN are having some issues. It seems that there are some allegations of financial improprieties going on within their organization.

For those of you that don't know what TBN is, it is the Trinity Broadcasting Network. The worlds largest Televangelical network. They broadcast all sorts of evangelical television to the idiotic masses that eat it up and send their hard earned money to "get god's blessings and prosperity". You know the way it goes, "let us pray" Oh, and for only a donation of $100.00 I will send you gods' autograph! This network has been poisoning minds since the middle 1970's with their religion of prosperity and faith healing bull shit.

Recently, it seems that their own family members being the greedy little shits that they are, are now fighting about money! Yes, that's correct. Jesus fearing folks preaching prosperity, honesty and following the 10 commandments are fighting about money and how the upper echelon of the organization are IMPROPERLY using the donations sent in by the loyal followers and believers in their network to do things like buy multiple Million dollar plus homes across the country, drive fleets of ultra expensive vehicles, fly round the world in private planes etc. It seems that some of the kiddies don't feel like they are getting their fair share of their family's ill gotten gains.

Here is the story in the New York Times if you want to read it. It's long but interesting.

In my mind, this just proves my point. Religion is NOT about getting to the "fantasy man in the sky" it's about MONEY. It's about good old fashioned greed. Yes, folks that's correct. Your belief and faith is all for the folks at the top of the religion pyramid to get their cash. If you think it's for any other reason, you really need to reexamine what they tell you every Sunday.

The essence of the Sunday meeting probably goes like this:

1. - babble about a biblical or scriptural principle
2. - declare faith in "fantasy man in sky"
3. - admonish the sinner
4. - ASK FOR MONEY

Correct me if I'm wrong, but having worked in the Direct Response industry for over a decade now, what that looks like to me is the standard format of an INFOMERCIAL. It's a simple sales technique, you pitch what you are selling, initiate a "call to action" in this case praying etc. Then set a "limited time" (hell, damnation if you don't comply). then "close the sale" (ask for the Money). This is DR 101 kids. It's not rocket science, but all the idiots out there just SUCK IT UP.

Please, Please, Please take of the blinders and see it for what it is. A fraud!

Students Walk Out on Dan Savage

Students Walk Out on Dan Savage

If the truth hurts........ It's sad. The bible is an allegory, not to be taken literally. Why oh why, don't people get that?

It's a great book of morality tales, stories of violence and intolerance. Not a book to live you life by....

Jeez,

When will people all wake up.

Go Dan!!!

Bible fact or fiction?

This has been something that constantly comes up in my mind.

Is the Bible fact? No. Even biblical scholars will tell you that the Bible is a set of allegories and stories meant to inspire or teach the reader life lessons etc. The Bible was NOT intended by it's authors to be taken literally.

It was never intended to be the 'word of god'. It was always intended to be a teaching tool. Taken literally the Bible is confusing and contradictory. Taken as an allegory for current events of the time and political and religious view points of the authors it makes sense in that respect. The truly sad part of this is this; fundamental Christians take it literally and ignore the FACT that it was never written to be taken literally.

Is the Bible fiction? Yes.

It's full of entertaining stories and fables. Did any of the fantastic and miraculous happenings in the Bible actually occur? Archeology says no it did not. There is NO written proof anywhere that any of these things happened other than a story in the Big Book of Fiction (bible). For example Jericho. Didn't happen, had it happened as told in the BBF there would have been independent proofs of this story outside of the biblical reference.

The falling frogs and pestilence in Egypt. Nope, no independent proofs there either. The Egyptians which by the way were huge on documenting everything didn't document glyph one of this incident occurring.

Noah's ark. Nope, no proof, no geological proof, nothing. Not to mention, it's a copy of the Sumerian flood story which took place 4,000 + years earlier!

Creation? Nope, same as Noah. Sumerians wrote about it first. So did the Egyptians.

Are you seeing a pattern here?

I certainly am..

National Day of Reason!!

Today is the National Day of Reason!

This day is in direct counter to the National Day of Prayer.

Please take this time to think logically and participate in many of the NDR funtions and rallies that are taking place all over this great country.

Millennials rejecting religion?

In recent studies performed by the Public Religion Research Institute and Berkley Center for Religion and Peace, more and more STUDENTS are moving away from religion and becoming unaffiliated. Some of their main reasons for leaving are: Christianity is too judgemental, the students feel like Christianity has become too stringent and angry towards people in general.

Interesting facts from the study:

Only 23% of respondents felt that the Bible is the word of God. This is a move in the right direction, education takes the blinders off and the students start to see religion for what it is.

6 in 10 respondents feel that religion is "judgemental" and "Anti-Gay". It is, nice of you all to see it.

Less than 1/2 of the respondents list any religious affiliation on their facebook page or anywhere else.

Maybe, moving forward into the future, these millennials will lead the way to a more secular world where science and fact trump fear and superstition.

We can only hope.

The Founding Fathers KNEW we should keep religion OUT of Government

This article is VERY interesting!

I completely agree with the author. The founding fathers did indeed intend that religion and government should be separate.

Fanatics like Santorum and the Religious Right would tell you differently, they are wrong! Several states have passed laws SNEAKING religion into schools etc. Even religious people NEED to stand up and say THIS IS WRONG.

It's chilling what is happening with the religious right. It needs to be STOPPED.

Religious Materials in Schools?

In Asheville NC, the Buncombe School board is considering allowing religious organizations to FREELY distribute religious materials to students on school property and DURING school hours. IMHO this is grossly inappropriate. There is no reason why a religious organization should be able to distribute their propaganda to students in PUBLIC schools.

If parents want their children reading religious texts or materials, they can get them from a myriad of religious groups ON THEIR OWN TIME. The tax-payers don't need to be funding the equivalent of state funded religious education. I am not only taking this from the atheist standpoint but from anyone whose religious beliefs contradict evangelical christian dogma.

Think about this: You are Muslim, your child goes to school and comes home with a Bible and several pamphlets outlining how Christianity is right and ALL other religious beliefs are incorrect and false. How do you react to this? What conversations do you now have to have with your child because of materials that your child should never have received at school?

You are Mormon, you child comes home with anti-Mormon pro evangelical literature outlining how your belief structure and dogma are a cult. What do you do? How do you fell?

You are Jewish, your child comes home with a pamphlet outlining how the Jews are evil and killed the christian savior. How do you reconcile this with your child?

You are black/Hispanic/Asian, your child comes home with some "christian:" propaganda from let's say the KKK. How do you deal with this garbage?

You are christian, your child comes home with a Book of Mormon or Q'uran? How do you explain to your child what you believe without promoting hate and dissension?

As you can see this is NOT a good thing. I didn't even go into atheist or pagan beliefs that would be dramatically impinged on by putting this propaganda and fantasy material in a place where it should NOT be.

If you live in NC, you should be outraged and calling on whatever political powers you can to try and stop this idiotic school board from doing this to not only your children, but every ones children.

Religious beliefs are fine if that's what you choose to do. They do NOT and cannot belong in the public school system. Anything short of a non-religious, non-bias education is a disservice to your children and will only contribute to the continued disintegration of our society.

I say stop it now!

Are Christians Cannibals?

I ask the question: Are Christians cannibals?

I ask this question not to be 'snarky' or to poke fun at anyone. I ask out of sincere curiosity. Why do I ask? It's simple it appears to me that the Bible endorses it.

Read the bible passage below, it's taken from KJV of the bible.


"And thou shalt eat the fruit of thine own body, the flesh of thy sons and of thy daughters, which the LORD thy God hath given thee, in the siege, and in the straightness, wherewith thine enemies shall distress thee:"


Deuteronomy 28:53

To me that says CANNIBAL!

If I am wrong, please tell me how I am...

Would love to read a Christians explanation of this....

Quotes from LDS General Conference

Yes, I know I'm a bit late on this. It's mostly due to me NOT watching General Conference but waiting for it to be done so I can go over some of the 'nitty gritty'.

These are quotes that were posted at http://www.graceforgrace.com/ . She is a Mormon apologetic and posts her thoughts etc. I wanted to go over her 'favorite quotes' and give my feedback...

I am only going to go over the quotes she posted that I found either humor or reprehension in:

Russel Nelson, an apostle, discussed in part the absurdity of the Big Bang Theory and made a great comparison.  He said “Could an explosion in a book factory create a dictionary?” A ridiculous comparison. It's much like the "Watch in a bag" argument. If you can prove that the universe was created through intelligent design, PROVE IT. Don't give me stupid arguments because YOU don't understand it, PROVE your argument. Making blatant anti-science comments like this from the pulpit is just plain ridiculous! I wonder, does he even understand science? Has he opened a book since the 1960's? I doubt it.

Todd Christofferson, and apostle said something that I’ve said a few times on this site that we’ve had discussions on regarding when a prophet is speaking as a prophet vs. as a man.  He discussed an example of how Brigham Young one morning said a lot of opinionated things to a group of LDS Saints and later in a church meeting he got up and said “this morning you heard what Brigham Young had to say…now you will hear what the Lord has to say”.  The quote I liked from Christofferson was “Not necessarily every statement by a prophet is revelation.” Ahh yes, the standard 'mormon disclaimer'. They TALK to god and purport to bring messages FROM god, but ONLY when it suits them and you cannot refute what they are saying.

President Thomas Monson discussed how most of the things we worry about in life are of little importance compared to the big questions we ask during trials in our lives.  He also discussed making the most of our lives and not aimlessly going through life.  The quote I like from him was something to this effect: “we enter mortality not to drift through the waters of life.  We have the power to reason, think and achieve…” So WHY do you as an institution dissuade your members from THINKING when it involves the absolute FRAUD that Mormonism is? Why do you do that? Because you Don't want them thinking you want them donating and working.....

L Tom Perry gave a talk on the Book of Mormon.  The quote I thought was great was this “Are you a Mormon?  If not, you should be!” Need more 'revenue generators' do you?

America, a Nation of Heretics?

I recently read a review by author Ross Douthat regarding his new book "Bad Religion: How we became a nation of heretics"

The interview was an interesting read, I do take issue with a few of his points as he is obviously pushing to get back to a more "institutional religion" for Americans.

You can read the entire interview here:

"Institutional religion in the United States — institutional Christianity in particular — is much, much weaker today than it was 40 years ago. But religion itself is as strong as ever. ... But the eclipse of institutional faith, and the eclipse of what I would say was a kind of a Christian center that the country used to have, has created a landscape where religion divides us much more than it used to." Exactly, that is why religion especially institutional religion is NOT a good thing.

Overall, not a bad interview, I don't buy his conclusions. I do find his arguments interesting.

Is America falling apart? No, I don't think it is.

Do we need more institutional Christianity. NO. We need, free thinking people that decide for themselves what is good and believable. We do NOT need someone telling us what to believe.

Year of the Bible?

The State House of Representatives in PA have declared 2012 "The Year of the Bible" and according to the resolution are officially encouraging the citizens of PA to follow the teachings and guideance of the Bible.

The Freedom From Religion Foundation is suing to have this overturned and REMOVED.

Good Job Guys! Get that overturned, the Government has NO business telling anyone what god to worship or what religious book to read!

Right wing religious nut jobs are going to ruin our great country if we don't curb this unabashed assault on our freedoms.

War on Religious freedom?

Interesting story in the Turkish Press.

It's amazing to me how the Christian Right can run round screaming at the top of their lungs that THEIR religious freedoms are being attacked and eroded when it is THEY who are focusing on forcing their beliefs down the throats of everyone who is within ear shot of their voices.

"We're starting to see our religious freedom taken away. Our Christian faith is being stepped on. Like kids in the schools -- they can't talk about God," Seriously? What about those of us that don't want to hear about your fantasy world in school? What about those folks in the world that don't believe the same as you? Don't they have the RIGHT to NOT hear about your gods in school?

"There's something wrong in America." Yes, I will tell you what is wrong in America... YOU!

"Christians are persecuted in many other countries and I think this is the next one," Really? YOU are persecuted? YOU? Have you listed to Faux News recently? All you folks do is BASH anyone that doesn't believe the way you believe. Typical Christian behavior... "We are UNDER ATTACK," even though it's YOU doing the attacking..

"They say it's the separation of church and state, but it's a falsehood," Dean said. No, buddy you are the falsehood. The separation of Church and State was designed to give you not only freedom OF religion conversely also freedom FROM religion.
The first amendment -- which prohibits the "establishment of religion" -- was written because the founders were concerned that government would interfere with religious practices, he insisted. So Wrong again. Read the freakin' amendment will ya!
The Supreme Court, however, has interpreted the clause to mean that the government cannot promote religion. As did former president Thomas Jefferson, main author of the Declaration of Independence, who wrote that the establishment clause sought to create a "wall of separation between church and state." Yes! Exactly Right. Thank you Supremes!

Yet many evangelicals and conservatives like Dean read the constitution and Declaration of Independence differently, finding proof that the United States was founded as a Christian nation. Sorry, kids. The good ole USA was founded as a SECULAR NATION. Again, read it.

"It's very hard to walk around any city in the United States and feel that religious people as a group or individually are suspect to mass persecution," Green said. Exactly! Ask an atheist or a Muslim who is being persecuted and you will get a VERY different answer.

If only we could see the USA for what it is. A secular nation that ALLOWS EVERYONE to practice or not, the religion or lack thereof of their choice. Sadly, I don't see this happening. Too bad we don't have an atheist running for president. If we did, I would definitely be voting for him/ her.

How do you feel about this?

Are you a Christian Crazy that supports this crap?

Are you a logical, intelligent human being that doesn't?

Where do you fall?

Santorum Drops out!

Just announced, Santorum has withdrawn from the Presidential race!

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Paul "PZ" Myers in Utah!!

This past Saturday 4/7/12 "PZ" Spoke at the University of Utah on Science and Atheism. It was a very interesting and enlightening speech.

He talked about the three core values of Atheism: truth, autonomy and community. All of which I espouse to follow.

It's funny though that he speaks about these three core values which I find many if not all, of my Atheist friends out there adhere to are the same values that the insane Christians shout from the rooftops that we are against.

Who is the liar and bigot now?

While the Atheist works to understand the world, the universe and our existence. The religious individual buries their head in the 'sand' and refuses to acknowledge anything other than what their 'holy book' tells them to believe.

Sad really.

Very, very sad.

Here are some comments from the religious, love your neighbor folks regarding "PZ" and Atheists in general, taken from the SL Trib.

Rocky Morrison : Below is a list of Myer's Scientific Achievements in the past Ten Years...

Rocky Morrison

 And he says that Science is the Atheists weapon.

Yeah, and Officially Atheistic Governments have used it pretty effectively to kill MILLIONS...100 Million in the past century alone...more than in all the wars in history

(The Black Book of Communism...Harvard University Press...and spare me the jive about Atheism not having anything to do with communism: Marx, Lenin, and Trotsky were all committed atheists who wanted to eliminate religion. And the later two put in place the machinery to attempt it. See Solzhenitsyns Three Volume series The Gulag Archipelago and he talks about the millions who were in the Gulags for no other reason than that they were Christians.)


Pretty telling isn't it? Religious folks using their standard rant of Atheists are evil etc.

Sooo very tired of their bigotry and stupidity.

Stand up and let your voice be heard, if you are a closet Atheist, come out and be a part of us, we need you.

How many people did god kill?

I got to thinking about this and decided to go through and take as close a number as I could, using ONLY the scriptural references where a specific number is listed.

Let's see the total killed in the name of god and mind you, with gods approval.

After this, stop and think for a second. Do you want to be part of a faith that worships a mass murderer?

Without further ado, let's get the totals started:

EX 32:27-29 With the Lord's approval, the Israelites slay 3000 men

 NU 16:35 A fire from the Lord consumes 250 men

NU 16:49 A plague from the Lord kills 14,700 people

JS 8:22-25 With the Lord's approval, Joshua utterly smites the people of Ai, killing 12,000 men and women, so that there were none who escaped

JG 1:4 With the Lord's support, Judah defeats 10,000 Canaanites at Bezek

JG 3:29 The Israelites kill about 10,000 Moabites

JG 3:31 (A restatement.) Shamgar killed 600 Philistines with an oxgoad

JG 15:15 Samson slays 1000 men with the jawbone of an ass

JG 20:43-48 The Israelites smite 25,000+ "men of valor" from amongst the Benjamites, "men and beasts and all that they found," and set their towns on fire

1SA 4:10 The Philistines slay 30,000 Israelite foot soldiers

1SA 18:27 David murders 200 Philistines, then cuts off their foreskins

2SA 8:5 David slew 22,000 Syrians

2SA 8:13 David slew 18,000 Edomites in the valley of salt and made the rest slaves

2SA 10:18 David slew 47,000+ Syrians

2SA 24:15 The Lord sends a pestilence on Israel that kills 70,000 men

1KI 20:29-30 The Israelites smite 100,000 Syrian soldiers in one day. A wall falls on 27,000 remaining Syrians

2KI 1:10-12 Fire from heaven comes down and consumes fifty men

2KI 14:5, 7 Amaziah kills his servants and then 10,000 Edomites

2KI 19:35 An angel of the Lord kills 185,000 men

2CH 13:17 500,000 Israelites are slaughtered

The death toll attributed to god, and mind you this in ONLY where a specific number is listed is: 1,085,900 people murdered in gods name. This does of course NOT include the killing of all the first Born's multiple times in the bible, the 'great flood' where more than likely MILLIONS more were killed. This is ONLY the atrocities committed where a specific number was listed.

This is just plain sick!

Over ONE MILLION murdered in gods name and this person is whom thousands choose to worship every day and encourage you to worship?

Not me.

I can't do it. I cannot bring myself to worship a MURDERER.

Is a belief in god important?

A philosopher John Gray doesn't think so. His position is that a belief in the existence of god is not necessary for either religious folks or atheists. He points to the fact that many religious groups, both poly theistic and mono theistic believe that it's more about the ritual and meditation than the actual belief in the existence of a creator or supreme being.

What it all comes down to in a genuine hope that there is something after this life. Am I hopeful that there is something after this? Not really, I feel like if I spend my time hoping that something good happens after I die that I waste my time HERE doing things to make my LIFE more fulfilling and happy. Rather than focus on what might be or 'could be'. I want to focus on what IS.

I was recently told that my disbelief in god is stemming from my anger towards god for some slight. This is wholly incorrect; I am not angry with god. It would be impossible for me to be angry with something that I don't believe exists. It would be much like being angry with the Easter Bunny for not giving me a chocolate rabbit and discounting it's existence because of it. That is just silly. I know that there isn't a giant bunny rabbit that delivers candy once a year, much like I know that there isn't a fat guy dressed in red that delivers presents to good children once a year. I'm not angry at him either. I just know that he isn't real, he is a story told to children to make their holidays more entertaining.

Then there is the crux of most believers arguments. Salvation. They want to believe in god because they want to be saved. It is natural to want to be spared the 'slings and arrows' of damnation or to be saved from pain and misery. Everyone wants to be comfortable and have a nice life. The believer focuses on the "all good, all knowing god" who according to their belief structure will 'save' them if they are good enough and follow all the rules. The fallacy to this belief is this: Even IF there is an all good, all knowing god, just because you do follow all the rules and do everything your beliefs tell you should, this could still be your fate: "Even if god is all powerful and all knowing, and powerful enough to save all the souls of the devout believer and of course is loving enough to do it, god still may NOT do it."

I choose to not believe and work to better my world as I can while I am in it. Spending time focusing on something that may or may not be there with no evidence that it does is not how I choose to live. I choose to live now.

What exactly is God? Cruel or Kind?

Studying the bible, I have come to the conclusion that not even the authors of the book let alone god knew what he/she/it were.

On one hand, god is described and kind and caring and then described as vengeful and mean. Either god has a major personality disorder or the authors just wanted to put THEIR version of god out there and hoped that someone would buy their version.

Here are the scriptures that I use to make this hypothesis:

"I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy." (JER 13:14) "Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not, but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling."




"The Lord is very pitiful and of tender mercy." (JAS 5:11)

"For his mercy endureth forever." (1CH 16:34)

"The Lord is good to all, and his tender mercies are over all his works." (PSA 145:9)

"God is love." (1JO 4:16)

So, which is it?

Is god insane?

Is god love?

Or, were the authors of the bible just so short sighted that they didn't bother to coordinate their thoughts before putting pen to parchment?

The Geneology of Jesus

This is an interesting argument I found on Infidels.org. I would suggest visiting and reading much of what they post there. It's very enlightening..

In two places in the New Testament the genealogy of Jesus son of Mary is mentioned. MAT 1:6-16 and LUK 3:23-31. Each gives the ancestors of Joseph the CLAIMED husband of Mary and Step father of Jesus. The first one starts from Abraham(verse 2) all the way down to Jesus. The second one from Jesus all the way back to Adam. The only common name to these two lists between David and Jesus is JOSEPH, How can this be true? and also How can Jesus have a genealogy when all Muslims and most Christians believe that Jesus had/has no father?

It seems to me that God can't even get his own "sons" genealogy correct. If they can't get the supposed most important person to their faiths heritage correct, how can you trust that the rest of the bible is anything but fantasy?

Jesus. Did he exist? Where was he born?

I have been thinking on this for a while. Doing lots of reading and studying to see just what I could find out. My conclusions are as follows:

1. - I have come to the conclusion that someone named Jesus did exist at some point. Much like Mohammad and Buddha there is just too much empirical evidence to deny that a person named Jesus did exist.

2. - Jesus was NOT a son of a supreme being. He was an enigmatic philosopher that had a lot of good ideas, many of them borrowed from other cultures and religious foundations. Still in all, they were good ideas and decent philosophies to live by. Golden rule etc.

3. - There is no empirical data showing that Jesus came back to life after being hung on the cross with other criminals ( he was considered a criminal since many of his ideas and his claim to be the son of god were considered blasphemous at the time ). The Shroud of Turin has been shown to be a forgery so there is no actual data showing anything of Jesus or anyone else being resurrected.

4. - The biblical story of him being born in Bethlehem cannot be verified. The date of his birth is in doubt and since there is no biblical connection (IE books by Jesus) in the Bible we can only assume that either he was illiterate or his ideas that he did write were too radical for the Bible. Since his birthplace cannot be verified as well as the date of birth, we have to assume that he was not the son of god as stated earlier. If he were the son of god as claimed, his place of birth and date should have been well known and documented in more that just a minor passage in one book.

5. - Proof of miracles. There isn't any. Just the word of someone that saw something or thought they saw something. You would logically think that if he were performing ACTUAL miracles, there would be independent corroborating stories and witnesses of these "miracles". There isn't any.

After all this thought and consideration I have come to the conclusion that someone named Jesus Christ did exist at some point in the distant past. Much like David Koresh and the Branch Dravidian's or the Heaven's Gate cult or Jones town he lead a group of people and preached a set of values. His 'cult' lasted much longer but is still just that, to borrow a term from the band Living Colour,  he had a great "cult of personality".

Was he the 'son of god' -- No.

Did he perform miracles? -- Nothing can be substantiated so, no he did not.

Did he rise from the grave? -- eww Creepy. No he did not.

Was he an enigmatic philosopher with a cult following? -- Yes, from all the evidence I believe he was.

Feel free to disagree with me. Or, conversely agree.

Did the Biblical prophets talk to god?

This question has vexed me recently. Not so much because I am concerned that maybe the "prophets" of the bible talked to god, but more so from the point of reference that they BELIEVE they talked to someone or something.

Here is my take on this:

They did NOT talk to god. At least NOT the god that they describe in the bible. What I think they did was talk to someone that due to their TECHNOLOGY appeared to be "god-like" to them and therefore god in their eyes. Was this being god? I don't believe so. I am going to put forward a theory that what these folks 2000+ years ago saw and talked to were visitors from somewhere else.

These visitors came here, met different people on different continents and in different cultures and in ALL cases were described as beings 'descending from out of the sky on chariots of fire' etc. These encounters are consistently described in much the same way across time-lines and cultural divides.

Before you discount this theory, think about this: If YOU were ancient man with NO understanding of technology outside of what you can make with your two hands out of rudimentary equipment with the highest technology you have being possibly Bronze metallurgy. Then you see a "pillar of light and fire" and from out of that fire a being emerges with bright light flooding from behind them. There is a loud sound like thunder (the crafts engines) and the being speaks to you.

How would you with your limited knowledge of the world and technology, never having read anything remotely close to sci-fi or fantasy. Hell, you probably can barely read your own language. How do you describe what happens? You probably equate it to what YOU know which would be a 'god theory' or experience.

This brings me to miracles. Specifically walking on water. You can walk on water. Is it a miracle? No, it's simple physics. If you can move quickly enough over the surface of the water, not breaking the surface tension on the top layer you will APPEAR to walk on water. If you would like an example of this google straw mats walking on water and you will see what I mean. You can do it if you have the right equipment in the right environment. Water is after all a non-Newtonian fluid.

What do you think?

Could it have been aliens in the bible and other cultures and not really a supreme being?

How do you explain it?

Reason Rally!

Yes!

Today is the Reason Rally in Washington D.C.

I wish I were able to attend as it would have been very cool to be there among the masses of Logical and intelligent folk rallying for reason in our nations capital. Unfortunately, economics and work precluded me from attending.

I did read a refreshing piece on the rally on Faux News of all places.  I have to say I was a bit surprised that they would even have run the piece given their proclivity for only reporting on the 'right' side of politics.

Thank you Faux News for running the piece by David Niose it's much appreciated.

Prayer in school? Take off your clothes first!

Wow. All I can say is wow.

A family in Philadelphia got upset at the school and disrobed in the parking lot and prayed. They didn't get divine intervention, Jesus didn't save them, God didn't come down and make the school officials do what the mother wanted. The POLICE did come and arrest them for being nude in public and trespassing.

Here is the story if you care to read it.

Hmm.

Is this an argument FOR prayer in school?

Would having prayer in school kept this from happening?

I don't think so.

Just more proof that religion is for CRAZY people. Logical, intelligent people don't strip down and pray to thier imaginary friends, we DISCUSS the issue with the parties involved and come to a logical and fair solution.

Just more Christian craziness.

PROOF: One more link in the Evolutionary Chain!

This is absolutely AMAZING!

I wonder how Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron fight THIS PROOF!

Oh wait, I can guess...... The devil planted the ENTIRE civilization!

Do you think the Devil did it?

Do you think it's proof of Evolution?

Tell me, I really would love to know what you think.

Is Atheism a religion?

This fellow's opinion is interesting if not a bit screwy. I found him while trolling the interwebz for interesting stories and opinions about a myriad of things. Honestly I just pull up my google news feed and read all kinds of interesting stuff. His entire opinion piece is posted here if you would like to read it. As always, I don't cherry pick, I give you all the facts and if you disagree, feel free to do so.

His arguements though I think designed to fire up Atheists are fairly weak and like I said contrived more to get some talking going. I like to call pieces like this "opinion trolling".

His main argument is: "The cornerstone of the belief system is that there are no Gods or anything else supernatural or spiritual and that no non-Atheist understands Atheism."

This in and of itself is incorrect. It is NOT a belief system so much as it is a system of understanding based on empirical data and a patent lack of proof that there is a supreme being that controls the universe. I have to give the guy credit though. He does make for an entertaining read.

Do you agree with him?

Do you agree with me?

Where do you stand?

Christian apologist arguing god with an atheist

While surfing the Interwebz I came across this great site for entertainment value only in my eyes. It's The Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry. Essentially they are there to make excuses and try to refute ALL other belief structures as wrong and or incorrect. I found a post there between one of the apologetics and an atheist. I am posting it here and will put my responses in BOLD to the conversation below.

This atheist actually believed he knew for a fact that there was no God. I found that position to be interesting and, quite honestly, not possible. Of course you did, you will say anything to get people to believe in your illogical and ill conceived notions of there being a magic man in the sky.
Also, he and I discussed faith a bit towards the end.

Atheist: As to religious arguments I haven't found one that can stand up to the logic of atheism.

Matt: Are you a strong atheist or a weak one? An atheist is an atheist. A theist is a theist. What is the necessity of ranking them other than to prove an illogical argument?

Atheist: Never heard of a weak atheist. EXACTLY!

Matt: I’ll explain. A strong atheist states that there is no God. He knows there is no God. A weak atheist, basically, 'lacks belief' in a god of any sort. So conversely, a strong Christian knows they ARE a sinner and a weak Christian just thinks they "might be."? Stupid if you ask me.

Atheist: Then I am a strong atheist. Don't buy into his crap. Just say "I am an Atheist. No additional definitions needed."

Matt: Then you know there is no God? We all there is NO God, just like we know there isn't an Easter Bunny.

Atheist: As much as knowledge can tell us yes..Maybe it's you who have to catch up on your atheism... Agnostic fits the description pretty well of a weak atheist... Maybe he also needs to catch up logic, reason and intelligent debate.

Matt: That is what I said...which are you?

Atheist: I am a strong. Characteristic human thought, coupled with hope is what religion boils down to, the unexplained tried to be explained...

Matt: So, you know there is no god?

Atheist: Yes.

Matt: How can you know that?

Atheist: It's a reasonable assumption. If you want a definitive answer. Does any Christian bother to look in the dictionary to what truth actually means? There is no 100% anything. Only close to it. Why oh why did you go there? This will just feed his argument. Honestly, just state the facts, you will NEVER convice this guy of anything.

Matt: Then you cannot KNOW there is no God. Your strong atheism is illogical. No, belief in a magic man in the sky THAT is illogical.

Atheist: Let's look at Christianity. It runs on faith. Faith is not logical. It gives credence to unicorns, goblins and thing s that go bump in the night. Exactly.

Matt: Nope. The subject is your atheism. Please don't try to change the subject. Oh, he doesn't want to defend belief in god, he just wants to attack a non-believer. Typical.

Atheist: The subject can jump where ever.

Matt: Your atheism is illogical. You cannot know there is no God. To do that, you'd have to know All things to know there is no God. And conversely, you would have to know the same to know that there IS. Your argument is illogical as well. Using YOUR logic we must believe in Santa and the Tooth Fairy.

Atheist: I will defend, but also place in attack. Try to defend faith

Matt: One subject at a time....You'd have to have seen all evidences to know there is no God. You cannot claim this, therefore, your atheism is illogical. Seriously? that is your argument?

Atheist: You can never see all evidences but that does not mean there is a god.

Matt: Correct.

Atheist: No, that means there is not enough information for a conclusion. So we make assumptions as best we can according to our knowledge...

Matt: But you must concede that your claim to strong atheism (that you know there is no God) is not logical. You gave the definition which is ridiculous on its face therefore your entire premise is not only illogical but moronic.

Atheist: My knowledge of the human brain leads me to believe there is no god...

Matt: Then that means there MIGHT be a God, because you don't know all the evidence. Therefore, you must logically be an agnostic. Why the word play? Because you CANNOT defend the position that there IS a god. Why can't you? Because there isn't. You can't prove there is and so you attack using word games to cover your own ineptitude.

Atheist: And so must you... But you picked a side.

Matt: Then it [your atheism] is not logical, but only assumptions you base your atheism on. Your atheism is untenable.... You must admit that agnosticism is more logically viable. If you admit that, we can discuss my faith. Ahh now it comes out. Your entire argument is to get someone to admit something they don't believe so you can SHOVE your beliefs at them and hope they accept it. Poor strategy my friend, poor strategy.

Atheist: I'm not ignorant to say I don't use faith. But only the usage of faith in a situation that remains provable.

Matt: So, are you agnostic or atheist? which is it?

Atheist: Atheist.

Matt: You've lost the argument. Sorry... It's a one sided argument, of course he lost. He lost before it started since you as the instigator set the rules without letting him know what they were! Just like your magic man in the sky. You change the rules when it suits you.

Atheist: Wrong. What you're doing is a ploy. You bring me over.. but you stay the same. Either you must move over as well or the argument is mute in the first place. One can not keep faith and call his beliefs logical. For a bit I will stray over to the agnostic side. But I am willing to state instances where I believe prove my contention that there is no god. Nice my friend, nice.

Matt: You have been cornered.... It is not logical for you to claim strong atheism. You have not seen all the facts. Therefore, the possibility of God's existence is real. Therefore, you must admit that agnosticism is more logical in this situation. Alright, Let's talk faith. What? You have done nothing but talk in circles. Nothing you have said is logical or in any way pulls anyone toward your argument. You simply cloud the issue to forward your own agenda.

Atheist: Alright faith. you first.

Matt: I believe God exists. I have faith that he exists. Of course you do. How else do you explain unicorns, santa claus, and the easter bunny?

Atheist: Proof.

Matt: I have none. So you admit you are a WEAK Christian? hahaha. Argument lost according to your rules.

Atheist: No proof with faith. So, do you always believe in things that you can not prove?  I see where you are going. I doubt he will let it go that way though.

Matt: No... not at all... I have evidences, but they cannot lead to 100% proof or else all could be forced to believe. But, if there is enough evidence, I do believe. Again, you are a Weak Christian!

Atheist: So you must be agnostic in that sense as well.

Matt: No... because I make choices. Though it is possible for my faith to be proven wrong, I still rest on the evidences and draw logical conclusions. Faith in a magic man in the sky is illogical. Therefore your faith is illogical and your arguments are silly and worthless.

Atheist: Evidence....

Matt: Yes.... And that evidence would be what?

Atheist: Then you disregard one of the most fundamental rules of the game...

Matt: Which is?

Atheist: "Where ever knowledge is incomplete, there is a place for "faith;" but where ever knowledge and "faith" conflict, it is "faith" which must be modified or abandoned." Exactly.

Matt: Or the understanding must be reevaluated.... 'Facts' have been found to be wrong before. Very true, the Earth is indeed a sphere.

Atheist: Facts are not Truths. They are reasonable assumptions. I will get a dictionary definition for that one...

Matt: That's fine. So what about it? What kind of evidence would be sufficient for you to conclude there is a god? Oh, I don't know. Meeting God would be a good start.

Atheist: Fact - Reality or actuality as distinguished to from conjecture or fantasy; Something known by observation or experience to be true or real.

Matt: That's good.... Now... what would constitute evidence for God's existence? Meeting God. Hearing a chorus of angels etc.

Atheist: An instance of superiority... Something humans could not do.. OR not be able to explained through phenomena but event then...  You mean like a giant hand coming out of the sky.

Matt: That's good... now... what would constitute evidence for God's existence? Gods hand coming out of the heavens for the world to see.

Atheist: A universal movement. A stoppage of the planet. Nothing earthly. nice.

Matt: If that were to happen, would you conclude there was a god? Couldn't it be explained in other ways? No. I would not conclude there was a god till I met him or her.

Atheist: I would of course doubt it at first. I would look for an explanation... And for something like that I would probably find no reasonable explanation..

Matt: If you had could not find one, what would you conclude? Would you conclude that there is a god? or that you simply don't have all the facts?

Atheist: You never have all of the facts... Reasonable assumptions, remember?

Matt: Then you could not safely conclude it was the hand of God, could you?

Atheist: Nope. that would be the only explanation that I could think of that would have the three means, opportunity. (forget motive) [I did not understand him here...]

Matt: Then you couldn't know anything for sure, right? That is, if you don't have all the facts, all of them.

Atheist: Haven't we already agreed you can never have all the facts?

Matt: What you are telling me is that you have no real way of proving or disproving God. So then, doesn't it come down to faith based upon evidence? I have evidence.... You can't have evidence. Of course you will claim something silly like weather, trees or people. Maybe even resort to the BuyBull but we all know that is smoke and mirrors.

Atheist: I have to go. Friends just arrived. Can we finish this later?

Matt: If you want....

I'm not sure how it went with this atheist. But I hope some seeds were planted.

They weren't I am sure he left irritated and frustrated with your complete lack of logic and intelligent debate. Talking in circles NEVER got anyone anywhere. Enjoy spinning your wheels Matt.

I will be following up with more posts and hopefully I will get the opportunity to debate with this fellow soon......

A Nigerian Scammer Joins "My Church" pt 13

From: Tits Mcghee H.P.E.
To: Dr. Mrs. Louisa Pimentil Estrada

Sister Estrada,

It is good to hear that our efforts to assist you are appreciated. It is erection inducing to know that you are ready and willing to receive the sacraments of the Great Phallus, and that you do wish to become one with the Testimonial Testicles.


To answer your question the Sock Washing Drive will be finished mid week and we will have the funds immediately transferred by Western onion to you so that you will be able to feed your starving presidential family. I am sure that your caviar supplies are running low now.


Fellations 5:77 " Eat of the Phallus, drink of the Phallus and you shall be strong and virginal before the Lord of Hostess. All who come before the Great Phallus on bended knee in supplication shall receive their reward."


Since you are fast becoming a solid member of the Church, it is incumbent upon me that I make this request of you now. In order for you to take the next step within the teachings of the Great Phallus, you must begin the Rite of Aid or CVS Pharmasy program. What this requires is your diligence, faith and above all your willingness to see the program through.


The requirements of the program are as follows:

1. Bring 2 new members into the fold of the Church. (they must also sign and send to us a copy of the membership agreement.)

2. Supply a photo of the new members holding a sign bearing their allegiance to the Church of the Assimilated Virgin. Something like "I have been Assimilated" will be fine.

3. Send the Church a handwritten letter describing how you will offer your corn hole as a place of solace and refuge to all Sailors, Inmates, and men of consience.

4. Denounce all former religous ties to any other religion with a formal declaration of faith.

5. Observe the holy day of Fellatrixation (May 2) by standing naked in your window for 1 hour before sunrise and before sunset. (provide photo of this if possible).

Once you have completed these tasks, you will be more on your way to becoming a great and trusted member of the Church of the Assimilated Virgin.

I am looking forward to hearing from you and welcoming you into the fold of the Great Phallus.

May the Great Phallus keep you wet.

Tits Mcghee
High Phallic Elder

so, she writes back thinking that she can avoid the "tasks" I have laid out for her. I DON'T THINK SO!

Attn: Tits Mcghee(High hallicElder)
Sir

How are you today?No newsfrom you yet. I look forward to your urgent reply. Thank you andGod bless us all.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa PimentelEstrada.

So of course I write back and put her back on track. This should be a fun little round of email blasting teehee

From: Tits Mcghee H.P.E.
To: Dr. Mrs. Louisa Pimentil Estrada

Sister Estrada,

The Church is doing wonderfully. We are very blessed to be part of such a great and powerful faith as the Church of the Assimilated Virgin. I confer upon you the blessing of the Kuhm Burping Fellatrix. It is a great honor to have this blessing given to you, and I hope that you will proudly tell all with whom you speak of this great blessing!


How is it coming with the tasks that I have set before you? Have you accomplished them yet? I have not heard from you regarding them, it is very concerning to me that I have not heard from you regarding these simple requests.


Eurethra 17:23 "For he that completeth all things shall feel the glory of the great Phallus. Yea, even the lowly Pubococcus shall be blessed in the great and wonderful glory hole."

Let me know when you have completed the tasks that I have set before you and great blessings of prosperity and wealth shall be yours forever.

May the Great Phallus keep you wet.

Tits Mcghee
High Phallic Elder



She never responded to me after this email. I think she got tired of the game and moved on to 'easier marks'. It's sad really, I was having tons of fun at her expense.

I hope you enjoyed this little saga, I hope to have much more fun doing many other things and letting you ALL know about it!

A Nigerian Scammer Joins "My Church" pt 12

this little saga may be over, but we will see what happens....
So, she ran whining back to Tits Mcghee

Attn: Mr Attn: Tits Mcghee(High PhallicElder)
Sir,

Thanks for yourmail and I wish to notify you are like that of a Shepard and as aShepard you are supposed to guide your sheep even when they are goingastray. The mal words you are using on me, do you think you aresupposed to sue it on your on me as a member been a Shepard you are.Why? I was not happy when I was told that it was set up and I nowbelieve that those police are spies. Please let forget about that andmove forward. If I said I was going to pull out from the church andwithdraw my membership card back was statement made out annoyance
Ilook forward to your urgent reply.
Thank you and God bless usall.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa Pimentel Estrada

JEEZUS!! I really wish she would learn how to spell and write! Just reading the bullshit she is spewing is giving me a headache!

From: H.P.E. Tits Mcghee
To: Dr.Mrs. Louis Pimentel Esstrada

Sister Estrada,

I understand that you feel that you were "set up" by "spies" and such. What would make you think that they were "spies"? They are both good upstanding members of the Church of the Assimilated Virgin and have dealt with you honestly and truthfully at every turn. I have personally spoken with them regarding your concerns, and they both assure me as members of the Church that they are NOT spies nor are they interested in "setting you up".


I have been informed that they are not able to re-open your claim/case as once you decided to close the case that permanently bars them from re-opening it in the future.


As to your emotional outburst earlier, that can be forgiven by myself and the Church. I am sure if you sent an apology to the Church and it's members that would be sufficient for us to satisfy what is necessary to maintain your membership in the church. I would suggest in the letter that you make great mention of your willingness to open your corn hole to all the needy phalli of the world. It would be prudent for you as well to sign all your future correspondence with an appropriate signature line such as "Open Corn Hole of Love".


I do believe that if you do those things, you will have gone a long way towards bringing yourself back into good graces with the Church and it's membership. I do need to ask you these following questions, and you must answer them truthfully.


1. Have you knelt and worshipped the Great Phallus?

2. Do you offer your Corn Hole to all Sailors, Men of Consience and Inmates?

3. Do you honor the Phallus by penetrating the Corn Holes of others?

4. Will you swallow the offering of the Great Phallus?

5. Are you willing to submit to the teachings of the Great Phallus and the meanderings of the wet and waiting vage?

6. Have you maintained a vigilant watch for the Testimonial Testicles?

7. Will you cup the Testimonial Testicles and caress them with all your heart?

8. Has your taint been cleansed by the great tongue of love?

I expect an answer to all of these questions as it is very important to your development in the Church. The more you learn and grow with the Church, the more will be asked of you. The rewards of which are immesurable both in material things such as money and physical things but in spiritual things as well.


It the Great Book it states: Book of Testicles 3:69. : "For it is the responsibility of all men and women, to worship and be blessed with the offerings of The Great Phallus. Yea, all must worship and not be whores unto the babylon of lies and deceit."

Also, in Fellations 32:77.: "Suck the great rod into your mouth and accept the offerings of The Great Phallus. Your vage shall remain open and your Corn Hole an oasis to all who request it of ye. Yea, even fellate those that ask, it is a great duty to fellate all."

I think it would be a good idea for you to also get a copy of our holy scriptures. If you cannot find a copy we can send you one as well. The title of the Great Book is: The Testimonial Testicles of The Great Phallus. Get it, read it, and live it.


Please answer the questions I have posed to you and get back to me when you have.

May the Great Phallus keep you wet,

Tits Mcghee
High Phallic Elder

Gee I wonder if she will answer my questions and get herself a copy of the book?
so she finally gets back to me with another sob story...

Attn: Mr Attn: Tits Mcghee(High PhallicElder)
Sir,

Thanks for yourmail and I wish to notify you and the whole church that i am confusedand belive me that i don't know what i am doing now by seeing mychildren crying every day and night of what to eat. Please tell thewhole church to kindly help my family.please they should not look uponwhat i have caused the whole chrch.
please please sir.
Ilookforward to your urgent reply.
Thank you and God bless us all.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa Pimentel Estrad

Notice, she can't even spell her own name!so of course I respond to her and make things even worse for the stupid idiot!

From: H.P.E. Tits Mcghee
To: Dr.Mrs. Louis Pimentel Esstrada

Sister Estrada,


It saddens me to hear that your children are starving in your presidential palace in the Phillippines. As I have previously told you the Church would be more than happy to assist you, but we need to be sure of your conviction and belief in The Assimilated Virgin. That is why I asked you the questions that I did. I am putting them in this email as well, so that you may answer the questions either in an email or you are welcome to call the Church by phone and either tell me personally or leave your answers on our answering service. Again, the questions were:


1. Have you knelt and worshipped the Great Phallus?

2. Do you offer your Corn Hole to all Sailors, Men of Consience and Inmates?

3. Do you honor the Phallus by penetrating the Corn Holes of others?

4. Will you swallow the offering of the Great Phallus?

5. Are you willing to submit to the teachings of the Great Phallus and the meanderings of the wet and waiting vage?

6. Have you maintained a vigilant watch for the Testimonial Testicles?

7. Will you cup the Testimonial Testicles and caress them with all your heart?

8. Has your taint been cleansed by the great tongue of love?

I am sure you have our telephone number correct? If not, it is (206)666-4930. You are welcome to call us anytime for help or assistance. Please do not be alarmed if you get the answering service, as the message still has Rev. Balls' voice on it. We are keeping it there out of remembrance for a great and loving man. He had great and heavy testicles and was an excellent fellatrix as well.


We here at the Church of the Assimilated Virgin await you with open corn holes and sopping vage's. Come to us on your knees in a postition of forgiveness and all will be forgiven of you.


Fellatians 6:23 "For the virgin so loved the world that she gave her self wholly and not in part to all that requested of her. Blessed are the fellatrices as they shall conquer the phallus before all others."

May the Great Phallus keep you wet,

Tits Mcghee
High Phallic Elder

here is more updated goodness for you!

Attn: Mr Attn: Tits Mcghee(High PhallicElder)
Sir,

Thanks foryour mail and i wish to notify you and the whole church to help us.Iwill answers the questions in an email.
Below are the answers to yourquestions.

1. Have you knelt and worshipped the GreatPhallus?YES.

2. Do you offer your Corn Hole to all Sailors, Men ofConsience and Inmates? YES I WILL DO.

3. Do you honor the Phallus bypenetrating the Corn Holes of others? YES I WILL DO.

4. Will youswallow the offering of the Great Phallus? NO I WILL NOT

5. Are youwilling to submit to the teachings of the Great Phallus and themeanderings of the wet and waiting vage?YES I WILL

6. Have youmaintained a vigilant watch for the Testimonial Testicles? YES IHAVE.

7. Will you cup the Testimonial Testicles and caress them withall your heart? YES I WILL.

8. Has your taint been cleansed by thegreat tongue of love?NO

Please sir, i will be very greatful if thewhole church will come to our help.I would have love to call you but forsecurity reason i will not be able because my lines are right nowconnected to the Philippines Telecommunication Network services.
Ilook forward to your urgent reply.
Thank you and God bless usall.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa Pimentel Estrada.

So of course after her answers to my questions, I get back to her again

From:TitsMcghee H.P.E.
To: Dr. Mrs. Louisa Pimentil Estrada

Sister Estrada,


I do appreciate your situation, and the wholechurch is mobilizing to assist you and your family in this great time ofneed. I have even contacted the US Embassy in the Phillippines and theyhave assured me that they will do whatever I ask of them to secure yourfreedom and liberty. You see, as members of The Church of theAssimilated Virgin, you are entitled to all the protections andliberties of such a great church in the US.

Thank you for beingso honest and frank in your answers to the questions which were posed toyou. We at the church do have one concern however: Your answer toquestion #5 has us a bit concerned. You will not swallow the offering ofthe Great Phallus? You see it is very important that you immerseyourself fully in the ways of the Great Phallus and the AssimilatedVirgin.

Cockeronemy 36:18 "Follow unto the Great Phallus in allthings, for it will never lead you astray nor will it lead you intotemptation."

Please let myself and the church know what else wecan do for you regarding your situation. Your last communication on thatmatter was rather vague.

I have also included a photo of our church in Springfield for you as well. As you can see we are a wealthyand powerful religion in the US.


May the Great Phallus keep youwet.

Tits Mcghee
High PhallicElder

and she of course continues with her sob story and the "please help us" routine

Attn: Mr Attn: Tits Mcghee(High hallicElder) Sir,

Thanks foryour mail and i wish to notify you that my family and i need financialhelp.
I have seen the attachment and i would like to tell you thtour church is very big and it cost alot of money to get that kind of bigchurch oh i really thank God for that. I have vowed that my familyand i will forever worship with you people throughout the days of ourlives.
Finally, please sir, do what ever you can to help usfinancially.
I look forward to your urgent reply. Thank youand God bless us all.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa PimentelEstrada.

Hmm, I think we will help her yet again. Damn Christians always turning the other cheek and all that good stuff. But, before I do, I am gonna make her wait about a week.

Attn: Mr Attn: Tits Mcghee(High PhallicElder)
Sir,
How areyou today? Please sir, what is going on?i have not heard from you orreceive any help from you either. Please kindly inform me what isgoing on.
Finally, please extend my regards to the whole church.
Ilook forward to your urgent reply.
Thank you and God bless us all.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa PimentelEstrada.

so I get back to her like a good priest should

From: Tits Mcghee H.P.E.
To: Dr. Mrs. Louisa Pimentil Estrada

Sister Estrada,

We are working to assist you, as you are already aware when Gaylord Fagg did what he did, he caused some serious issues within the Church as well as inconviencing many of our members overseas and in other parts of the galaxy.

Assholio 6:34. " For he that is patient and waits for the Phallus shall be blessed. If, he should falter in patience he will be castrated and left soulless."

The brotherhood and sisterhood of the Church are putting together a Sock Washing Drive to raise funds to assist your family in their terrible plight. We always do our best to make sure that members of our faith are well taken care of, and always blessed in all they do.

If all goes well, we will have raised more than 10,000$ which is our goal to send to your family. Now, I know it is not as much as we were initially sending to you but with all of the problems we ran into previously it is what will be available to you this go round. I am sure in the future, more money will be made availble to you if it is needed.

If there is anything else you need, please don't hesitate to contact me further.

May the Great Phallus keep you wet.

Tits Mcghee
High Phallic Elder

so she responds and is "praying for the church"

Attn: Tits Mcghee(High hallicElder)
Sir
Thanks for yourmail.I personally thank you for what you are doing to ensure that myfamily never suffered and i pray that the Great Phallus will alwayskeep and bless you in all your doings.I can not thank you enough but iknow that the Great Phallus will sure answered you when ever you openyour mouth to make a request.

Sir, I am very okay by yourmessage.But, when is the money going to be sent to me? I asked because iwant to know so that i can arrange on how the money will be sent tome.
My Family and i wishes you and the whole church happyEaster.
I look forward to your urgent reply.
Thank you and Godbless us all.
Warmest Regards
Dr. Mrs. Luisa PimentelEstrada.

so I respond with something that I think she will hate but you all should love!!